How Faith Helped Emily Overcome Adversity

[00:00:01] Speaker A: I'm Rachelle Smith, and my voice is a weapon against wrongdoing, and so is yours. Join me as I expose the truth and stand up for those affected by military sexual trauma. We can break the silence together. Welcome to the silence, voices of MST. Hey, everyone. Welcome to a new episode of the Silence Voices of MST. I'm your host, Rachelle Smith. As always, today we have an author as our guest. Her name is Emily, and she has one heck of a story to share with us. She's a fighter, and she's a public speaker. She also has some New York Times bestsellers out, so I'm gonna let her take over and introduce herself. And if you want to learn more about her books or how to book her for public speaking, I'll have all that information in the show notes. All right, here's Emily. [00:00:53] Speaker B: I've been doing advocacy work since about 2018 and not really a life I ever saw myself doing growing up. My first degree is in chemistry. I went to school for a masters in business and was living that american dream life. Shortly after getting my masters in business, someone approached me about leading a small group. And part of that was what the group talks about. And so I realized that day that if I was going to lead whatever group this was, that I had to start writing whatever that content was. And so three years later, that turned into my first book. But I knew pretty early on in my writing journey that it was going to be a three book series. And I tried to avoid sharing my story because I was like, oh, I don't want it to be about me. It's about, you know, I want people to learn about God and all these things, you know, trying to sound super selfless. Quickly was told by my writing coach that if I wanted to get my book published, I had to include the personal element in it, too. And honestly, I expected it to be pretty easy to do. It's my story. I know it pretty well. I know a lot of survivors don't share what happened to them. And that is a problem in and of itself for me. I was pretty naive at the time. I was 19, and I shared what happened with me pretty immediately because I just had no other expectation other than that people would believe me. [00:02:34] Speaker A: Right? [00:02:34] Speaker B: Like, why would I make this up so quickly? Was proven wrong. I was told it was my fault. And, yeah, that proved to be harder to write on paper than I expected it to be. Largely, I think it was that sense of control. Like, when I'm speaking to an audience, you can kind of read the room and I, you know, captivate, like, you know, target the audience that you're speaking to. Right. And in a book, you can't do that. And so, yeah, that. That sense of letting go was not the easiest thing to do. [00:03:09] Speaker A: Yeah, I can imagine. And so this. You don't have to share the event, but this. This trauma happened in your life, and you weren't believed that. That just. That sent you on a tailspin, I'm gonna guess. [00:03:24] Speaker B: Yeah. And honestly, it affects a lot more areas of our lives than people care to admit. So, for me, at the time that I was raped, I was very far away from home, and that's part of the reason why I shared what happened right away, because I knew that if I didn't, it would just stay in that location far away from home. Right. And just nobody would ever know a thing. Yeah, that was part of it. And honestly, it was more than just, like, losing that relationship with the person who had raped me. It was losing a lot of friends in social circles almost immediately, because once you're told, it's your fault, they're no longer safe people to be around. Not only that, the person started talking to someone else that he met because of me after that. Yeah, I had to remove myself from a lot of places, and it was very isolating. [00:04:22] Speaker A: Yeah. That's what a betrayal on top of, you have the trauma, and then it's very much like that in the military, too. If you report, all of a sudden, it's like there's this mass exodus of people from your life because they're like, I don't want that associated with me. Have you ever seen the videos of, like, there's sharks that are swimming through schools of fish, and there's that big circle around them? That's what it's like where there's just no one really to turn to. And I'm so sorry that you went through that. [00:05:01] Speaker B: Yeah. Unfortunately, that's the case for the majority of survivors. [00:05:05] Speaker A: So that's the truth. That's the truth. So when you did report and you have, I know for me personally, that was also a lot of what kind of led me. How can I put this? It really had me coping in all sorts of strange ways because I really just didn't have. It was like something blew up my life, basically, you know, and not having anyone to turn to, being blamed for it, having, like, a reputation all of a sudden, it was like I just. I don't know who I am anymore. When I look in the mirror. How did you kind of deal with that? Feeling. [00:05:53] Speaker B: I know that feeling well. And, you know, to me, I kind of describe it as, like, if you truly valued someone, like, raping them would be impossible. You just can't do it, right. And so, like, to be the victim of rape is just, like, this direct reflection of, I don't see value in you, right. Like, you are just treated like an object. Right. And so, of course, that isn't actually true. Like, my value is not able to be tainted by a human being. Right. It's so much bigger than that. Like, no. No person has that grade of power, but that doesn't mean that we don't believe it, that they do. Right? And so I definitely felt like, you know, my. My body isn't as, you know, worth it as it used to be. Therefore, I don't deserve anything that good. Right. I don't know. [00:06:50] Speaker A: Like, I completely understand. I knew that myself, you know? [00:06:57] Speaker B: And for a while, I didn't actually think that, you know, healing like I wanted was possible. Like, it just. That was just my new reality of that I was this used person. For a while afterwards, I mainly coped by drinking. Just, like, drinking my feelings away. And it was, you know, a few months after the event had happened, I was. I made some new friends in class the next semester and had told them what happened as well. And to my surprise, they gave me a different response. They didn't look at me differently, and I was just so confused because it's almost like, not that I wanted them to, but I definitely expected that. Right? That's what everybody else had done. And so, really, it was other people being able to see value in me in a time that I didn't know that I could. That gave me some hope that healing was possible. [00:08:00] Speaker A: Violin sounds like you were just a all around healthier group of people. That's wonderful that they found each other. I love that. I had a scene on your website that when that event happened in your life, that was kind of one of the first times you had spoken to God in a long time. Could you share more about that? [00:08:27] Speaker B: Faith is a really big part of my life now, but it wasn't when I was 19. You know, in the christian world, they use the phrase, you know, like, pray to receive God in my life. For me, that moment, I was about twelve. God made himself pretty real to me that he existed, but that was kind of where my relationship with God ended at the time. Like, he wasn't this loving father, good person, like, provider. Like, none of that. It was just like, yep, you're there. And so, you know, you go off to college, you're seeking for something bigger, better, like, the purpose of life, you know? And I just didn't know I could find that in God. So I turned to men into alcohol instead of, like a lot of college women do. And that night, especially, because I was so far removed from home, like, I had no car, I didn't drive to the place that we had gone to. Like, I just. I had no family to turn to. Like, I just was just stuck in this hotel room, essentially, right? And so I got mad and I went to God. I was like, all right, I know you're there, right? You're this. You know, you showed me you're real in the past, but I've never really felt desperate enough to turn to you until now. But really, it wasn't like it was more out of anger than it was out of love, right? Like, what did I do to deserve this? How could you let this happen to me? Like, I can't believe you would do that, God. Right? So that was more that momentous for me. [00:10:07] Speaker A: And then that moment turned into ministry, though. So how did you take us on a walk through that? [00:10:14] Speaker B: So the new friends that I had made, that I was telling you about a little bit ago, they led a women's group, a Bible study, at the college that I went to. You know, like I was saying, at that part of my life, I had sought this identity in relationships with men, and I really just didn't have, like, a. A woman mentor or anything like that in my life at the time. So I didn't have this, like, vendetta against men after being raped. Like, I didn't blame it on all men, but I also wanted a woman to talk to, you know, like, I just. And I didn't have it, and I didn't realize the importance of it until I didn't have it. And so gaining that community of women and support and really just, like, showing me what it looks like to have, you know, a relationship with God, and that was powerful. So that's kind of where the desire to lead that group myself came from, was to be that woman for somebody else who needed that group to turn to and to accept them in a time that they may not know how to accept themselves. [00:11:22] Speaker A: That's so amazing, and that's wonderful of you to do, to provide that kind of guidance. Cause, I mean, I know I for sure have been. There's been many times in life that I've just been lost, and it's because there was, like, an balance of energies around me, like, there was either too far masculine or too far feminine. There wasn't, like, a good. [00:11:41] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:11:42] Speaker A: And military wise, like, you know, you're thrown into just a pool of men. Trying to exist as a woman in a male dominated community is. It's difficult. It kind of feels like you're wrong no matter what you do. Yeah, but. So when you started this group and that, you said it led to writing, can you share kind of how that all went together? [00:12:11] Speaker B: Yeah. So kind of like I was saying that night, or when I met with those people about, you know, what does this group look like? And I realized that I needed to start writing the content for it. That's really all that I kind of ever dreamt it would go is just like, in my living room, you know, with these. However many women sign up for my group. And for me, a big heart in my ministry is John 832. That when we know the truth, the truth will set you free. So that's kind of the basis of each of the books, of what is the truth. And what freedom do I get from that truth? Yeah. So I started that, and then I finished the draft for my first book. This was a 2017 maybe ish, and I was at a networking event, actually, for the business school, and I sat across the table from this woman. We're just introducing ourselves, you know, an interesting fact. Whatever, right? And I'm like, oh, I'm writing this thing. I don't, you know, just start describing what the book is about. And she just, like, she looked at me, she said, I'm going to be the next best selling author. She took my phone out of my hand, and she called the New York Times best selling author who eventually became my writing coach. And it was from there that my writing coach was like, all right, like, are you going to make this a book or not? Like, what are you. You know, what are you doing? I'm like, I don't know what I'm doing. That's why we're here. Right. And so, really, again, it was like, people seeing something in me that I didn't know how to see in myself, you know? Whereas before, maybe it was value on, like, a. Just the overall humanity level. This was more like a value in. In my message, in that I had something that people needed to hear, and, like, that wasn't something I ever dreamt of, so, you know, like. [00:14:07] Speaker A: Where life takes us. [00:14:09] Speaker B: Yeah. Right. Yeah. Here we are. [00:14:15] Speaker A: Amazing. [00:14:15] Speaker B: Six years. [00:14:17] Speaker A: And the book series is called broken lenses. Correct? I. [00:14:22] Speaker B: That's right. Yeah. [00:14:23] Speaker A: Yeah. So broken lenses is that in terms of, like, broken glasses or, like, broken ways of seeing yourself? [00:14:33] Speaker B: Yeah. So, I mean, I. I had a different title for a while, and then I had a phone conversation with a really famous speaker, and he was like, what about broken lenses? And it was just one of those things where it was like, oh, yeah, you're right. And I didn't know why, but it just felt right. But, yeah, kind of like that whole looking for what is the truth. Right. And, you know, like. So for my second book, a lot of the theme is this contrast of, like, unity and division. And, like, do I see the people around me the way the world wants me to see them, or do I see the people around me the way God wants me to see them? And which viewpoint am I going to take? One leads to unity, one leads to division, and the choice is ultimately ours. Right. And so, yeah, well, that's a little. [00:15:29] Speaker A: Bit, that makes complete sense to me, honestly. And earlier, you had mentioned kind of trying to find the truth and kind of making purpose out of that. That seems to have been sort of like a mantra throughout your new writing career. [00:15:50] Speaker B: Yes. Yeah. You know, I've tried to do a lot of different things with my life, hence the different degrees. And, you know, now we're here round number three, doing a master's degree in social work. But it's one of those things where, like, I can try to do all these different things with my life. At the end of the day, like, God always brings me back into the advocacy world. I could be the most qualified businesswoman ever, and I, to some degree, am like, I've got the degrees, but, you know, I tried living that life and it just. It didn't succeed. And finally I got the hint of why it's like, this isn't where you're meant to be. Like, accept it. Live in the truth of who you are. And when you do that, you can't fail, because God doesn't fail. Right. [00:16:43] Speaker A: So how for, I guess, someone that has either recently gone through something like that or, you know, they might have been dealing with this, like, as a secret or something for decades, how do you think they could apply that truth and, you know, making purpose out of their assault to their own situation? [00:17:09] Speaker B: I mean, I think, for starters, realizing that truth of just, like, no human being is powerful enough to take your value away from you is huge. But also that, like, what you have to say matters. And, you know, if our world is so, like, undereducated in how to, like, handle situations with sexual assault and just as so like, ignorant to how often it happens. Like, here in Utah, I think it's like one in three women will be raped in their lifetime. Like, it's. It's more of a problem here, even more so than the national average, but it's just so we have to break that stigma of, like, I don't know, victim blaming, I guess, of just like. Yeah. So if you are a survivor and you're here listening to this and you've told someone and they don't believe you, like, it sounds hard, but find somebody else. Right. I have so many people, they'll say, well, like, what about people that are, like, false reporting? Right. And I'm just like, cool. False reporting happens. Yes. That is a factory. But the numbers that I've heard are between, like, two and 10% are false reports. [00:18:34] Speaker A: It's tiny. [00:18:36] Speaker B: I love numbers. Love them. So you're telling me that your apprehension that someone might be false reporting to you when, like, if you gave someone a bet, like, just in real life, and you told them they had a 90% to 98% chance of being right, would they take the other side of that bet? You better believe they won't. Right. [00:19:02] Speaker A: Absolutely right. [00:19:03] Speaker B: And so by default, why would you just not start by believing them? Right? [00:19:10] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:19:12] Speaker B: Because if you don't, you don't. The numbers are showing you that 90% to 98% of the time, you're going to be hurting them by not believing them. Yeah. Like, and it just. It blows my mind that people, like, are still asking me that question all the time, like, even as recent as a couple weeks ago. Like, I'm just like, cool. Yeah. But also, what about the other 98% of people? And it just. Yeah, that's a question I don't have the answer for, but I wish I did. [00:19:45] Speaker A: Yeah, I understand. I'm a part of a lot of different veteran groups on Facebook and, like, female veteran groups in particular. And I would say a lot of people kind of. They look back on the military in kind of, like, rose colored glasses where. Or they have these really wild opinions about, say, like, military spouses. I don't know if you know much about it, but, like, military spouses are overwhelmingly female, and there's all sorts of, you know, toxic nicknames for them. They call them dependas. And they're like, oh, they only walk around the commissary with, like, dirty hair and cookie monster pajama pants on and stuff. Like, there's a lot of just negative perception of how they live their lives. And I've noticed in these veterans groups, that it continues. And to me, it's. I'm sitting there like, a lot of these spouses have experienced domestic violence, and they don't say a word or if they repeat it or not even repeat it. If they report it like we were talking about earlier, they lose their entire circle. Like, everything's done. All of a sudden, a command turns against them and does everything to protect the member that's serving. And I like to point that out a lot in these groups. And I even had written a blog a few weeks ago when another person had, I think it was in military.com, they posted something about military service, be worth it. And it was all about spouses and how their experiences are mostly positive and stuff. And I was like, actually, let me pull up another numbers here and discuss the rate of domestic violence and discuss what the power and control wheel is and how the military is like, the perfect breeding round for domestic violence, because, like, when you were in college, you were far away from your family. You didn't have access to a lot of things. You didn't have a car. A lot of these women are in that very same situation. And also, when you're a military spouse, it's pretty difficult to stay employed because you move so much. Yeah, but I pointed this out, and I think a lot of the responses I get were, well, I hope you don't think that all military men are like that. And I'm like, so you're gonna not all men me this, like, okay, we're not talking about the people that aren't doing this. We are talking about the people that actually need help, and systemically, they cannot get help, so. [00:23:00] Speaker B: Right. [00:23:01] Speaker A: And it's just very, very frustrating when people are like, oh, yeah, but what about, like, please stop with that. [00:23:10] Speaker B: Yeah, I have. I don't know. I have a couple of my own theories on this, but it's just on the receiving end. You know, if someone is coming to you and telling you that they've been sexually assaulted and you believe them, the one thing you can't do is nothing. [00:23:28] Speaker A: Right. [00:23:28] Speaker B: And so the moment that I believe this person, now I'm holding myself, to some degree, accountable to do something. And people just don't know what to do. Right. And so they might feel bad afterwards, but it's like paralyzing them. They don't know how to believe them because they don't know what to do or how to respond. Right. But on the telling end, on the victim side, one of the most common reasons why they don't report is they tell themselves it's their fault, right? But we all know that's not true, right? But, you know, in my brain, if I can somehow try to convince myself that what happened to me was my fault, it's like they're trying to put themselves in the driver's seat of their healing process, right? If I can find the answer, I know how to, like, oh, well, I. I was raped because I did this. Well, I just won't do that in the future. And I'm like, sorry, that's actually, like, not true. And, you know, a lot of people in the trauma world, they talk about how, like, the healing's not linear, right? Like I was saying, for me, like, I thought I was good writing my story. In my book, I had, the story wasn't new. So why did I get to this point where I couldn't even think about my story without crying? Like, how, like, why was that hard, right? And so it's. Yeah, I don't know. Call me crazy, but. [00:24:58] Speaker A: I think that's a very valid reaction to have, because although you may have, you know, processed the trauma up here, it's still living in your nervous system. It's still in your skin, your hair, everything. So it's when you're. When you're writing about it, I can't remember what it's called, but, like, it's how your brain is processing it because you're, you know, slowly going through each letter while you're writing, like, you're actually reliving it. So it's difficult. It's really difficult. And I think that's, like, one of the parts of exposure therapy is they have you write, you pick a traumatic event that you're going to process, and you write it, you speak it, listen to it, and in theory, you're kind of desensitizing yourself to it, and you're practicing your coping skills the whole time you're doing all of this. For me, it didn't work, but I've seen it work wonders on other people. Like, for combat veterans, I've seen it really, really change their lives. I think for me personally, I had kind of, like, compound traumas, so I didn't really. It kind of made it a little worse. But people respond to different things, so that's okay. It just, you really have to keep trying everything out there just to see what's going to work with you, because every situation is different, every person is different, and you never know what's really going to actually work with you. And in my first season of silence voices, one of our guests was a chaplain, and she was sharing about how when she went through her situation, it just completely changed her outlook on life and changed her temperament, even. She was very angry and scared and just pretty much full blown PTSD. But when she leaned into her faith and leaned into her family and got guidance, it really just opened her mind to so many things. And now she's out there, you know, doing her best to actually protect other people from what happened to her. And she had been serving since the nineties, so she's seen the military change and, you know, trying to figure out what's going to work after throwing a bunch of stuff at the wall. But I really think that leaning into spirituality is a very beautiful thing because there's such a network within that. There's this just built in support with. With whichever religion you are a part of, and I think that's truly amazing. [00:27:53] Speaker B: Yeah. And there is a huge spiritual component to the healing process in general. The numbers I see are, like, 80% to 90% of people are raped by someone that they previously knew, trusted, had faith in to not do that. Right. And so, you know, even though it's not literally God doing or, you know, whoever. Whatever, higher power. Right. It's this human being doing the. The abuse. Like, we don't know who to trust anymore. I don't know what to believe. I don't. And all of that, like, rediscovering that is all spiritual, like. [00:28:33] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, definitely. And I know, like, some people, you know, they call it the universe or God or however they refer to what's larger than us, you know, I really think, like, whatever you believe, as long as you're able to find peace with it and find a way to accept. And for me, I don't know if I'm in the you have to forgive team or some people are, like, very militant about, oh, no, I'm not ever forgiving that person. But, like, for me, it was like, if I didn't forgive what happened, it still would have had control over my life. So I'm just like, you know what? I forgive. Like, of course I'm going to remember it and learn from it and hold that person accountable, but me, forgiving is finally letting that amount of control come off, you know? [00:29:32] Speaker B: Oh, I agree. [00:29:33] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:29:34] Speaker B: And forgiveness in general is more about you than it is about the other person. [00:29:39] Speaker A: Absolutely. So I was reading that you are on the board of the reveal to heal international nonprofit. Could you tell us a bit about that? [00:29:52] Speaker B: Yeah. So that was a nonprofit started by another great advocate. Her name is Jenna Quinn. She founded Jenna's law, and we met at a conference here in Utah. Jenna is also a Christian in the advocacy space. And so when we met each other at this conference and talked about our faith, it was about a year or so after that, she reached out to me and saying that she wanted to start this nonprofit. Just. There's a lot of gaps in how sexual assault is spoken of in the faith community and churches. Being equipped to, you know, talk to survivors, you know, is a big passion of both of ours, but, you know, with the idea of the name reveal to heal, the whole idea is that you can't heal what you don't reveal. So maybe you're not called to go out and speak to the masses like I am, but, you know, we do have to have a safe space to talk about it with. With somebody, like, get that counsel. Like, we're nothing. We weren't created to live this life alone. Yeah. [00:31:05] Speaker A: And very true. [00:31:07] Speaker B: Yeah. So. [00:31:12] Speaker A: If someone out there is struggling with trying to trust again and trying to maybe recognize who they see in the mirror, what would you like? If they were in your ministry? How would you guide them on how. [00:31:33] Speaker B: To trust other people again? [00:31:35] Speaker A: Yeah. Just how to work toward it. I know, like, it's not something that you just flip a switch, but it's more of. For me, it was hard to trust myself first. [00:31:47] Speaker B: You know, as far as, like, my leading, it would honestly, it starts by being the example. Right. Coming from the victim side of it, I didn't know who to trust. And really, the new friends that I had made afterwards showed it to me by their actions. They didn't expect anything out of me. They invested in me and saw value in me and didn't expect me to give anything back to them, which was powerful. [00:32:23] Speaker A: That's lovely. [00:32:25] Speaker B: And that, you know, by definition, is like, you know, the story of Jesus, like, dying on the cross, if you want me to be quite frank, it's like I'm dying for you whether you accept me or not. [00:32:40] Speaker A: Yeah, that's very true. Yeah. I really think it's hard to find people that are genuine like that anymore. So I'm really glad that you found them. Definitely in your time of need, too, after just being, like, shunned by people. It's awful. [00:32:57] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:32:57] Speaker A: You are also very involved in doing speaking engagements. How did that come about? [00:33:05] Speaker B: Well, the first speaking event I ever got, it was before my first book even came out. It was in 2018. I do a lot of work with the Utah Coalition against sexual assault, which is. Every state has a designated coalition. Since I'm in Utah, that's where I am. And I was just sitting in the office one day, and they were doing an event downtown, and someone just asked me, like, hey, do you want to speak at this event? You know, so it's not really a life I asked for. It was just kind of like being involved in the space, being willing, like, you know, and not ashamed. And so, you know, it was gradually getting more invites like that, where it instilled this belief in me of, like, oh, I can do this. You know, and kind of like I was saying earlier, like, I could speak on all these other things that I'm qualified to speak on. At the end of the day, the doors that always get opened in my life are always ones in the sexual assault world. So I kind of just, like, took the hint after a while and was like, okay, stop trying to do all these other things. Like, this is where you need to be. And when I'm faithful at being in those spaces and, you know, participating, like, the opportunities come. And so just before we spoke, actually, I was working on a presentation. I'm giving my first keynote speech. And that was another one of those things where I was at the Capitol here during our legislative session a couple months ago, and these people are like, hey, I heard you wrote these books and speak. Do you want to come be our keynote speaker? I'm like, yep, sure do. It's another one of those things of, like, hey, you're here. We know that you're willing to do this. Like, come join us. [00:35:04] Speaker A: Okay. [00:35:05] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:35:06] Speaker A: Yeah. Well, hey, congratulations on that. That's awesome. [00:35:11] Speaker B: Thank you. [00:35:11] Speaker A: Yeah, that was really cool. Yeah. Earlier you had mentioned that the statistic in Utah was one in three women. And that grows my eyebrows because that's actually the statistic in the military across the board as well. [00:35:32] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:35:33] Speaker A: Um, has. I guess. I mean, has anyone ever come to, like, the conclusion of why or they're still working on that part. [00:35:43] Speaker B: So, you know, Utah has a somewhat interesting culture dynamic, both just, like, spiritually and just, like, demographically speaking. Like, I did not grow up in Utah. And then moving out here, though, like that, you can tell immediately that there are a lot of people that are caucasian in Utah. It's just a thing. Which was, even as someone who's white, was still kind of shocking, but let's be honest anyway. Yeah. And so it's a very male dominated, like, status driven culture. And so it's hard to have a voice as a woman here, maybe more so than. Than other places. And I say all of this with love. And I'm not trying to, like, target anybody, but that is just right. It's, yeah. So, man, that's very much how it. [00:36:55] Speaker A: Is in the military, too, where it's. [00:37:00] Speaker B: Rules and, you know, it's, yeah, yeah, absolutely. [00:37:04] Speaker A: And I mean, I would say at least in the last, I think a lot of the support organizations for the bases, I think it was like the mid, around like, 20 06, 20 07, 20 08 that's when those organizations started. So there's, there's been a lot of change and growth, but the, like, hearts and minds haven't quite done that switch yet either. There's a lot of people that have their bias from how they grew up or maybe something that happened or just observations they have. And, I mean, now there's so many thought leaders with podcasts and stuff. And so me personally, like, I'm terrified of people. Like, well, maybe not terrified is the word, but, like, the influence that someone, like, say, andrew Tate has over young men. And to me, he's poisoning these young men's minds, and they're very, like, misogynistic ideals and very toxic masculinity just kind of pumping through their ears. Twenty four seven. And then these young men are just, like, influenced that way. And they think he's awesome and he has all these cars and all this money, and I'm like, but this dude is clearly not happy. So I'm like, a really happy individual would never espouse these kind of ideals. A happy person is all about unity, love. Let's make this world work together. They're not out spewing a bunch of toxic stuff of, oh, you have to be the alpha or whatever. So it's, there's all of these different influences now. So it's, it's interesting to me to see how this is really going to work out in the future because all of these young men that have been listening to that, they're, you know, now joining the military. So it's like eternity. It's a little worrisome. But then also, I do see Gen Z. They're very savvy in the world of social justice, where they're very cognizant of, say, people's pronouns and making homophobic jokes and things is not cool with them. And that's such a stark difference from millennials, how we grew up and what we saw on tv would never fly now. And I think that's amazing. Like, the me too movement was huge for, for changing even what was going on in the entertainment world. And I did just see that documentary that came out about Nickelodeon, and that was absolutely heartbreaking. So. [00:40:00] Speaker B: Oh, yeah. I haven't watched it, but I've seen a little bit here and there about it. Yeah. [00:40:06] Speaker A: The more that people keep talking about these kinds of things, though, and exposing that, there's, like, that unspoken rule of this is how you're gonna succeed is by keeping quiet. That's not gonna fly anymore. And I'm thinking maybe Gen Z's kids will be the ones to finally, like, stomp all of that stuff out where, like, no, if someone's treating you badly, speak up right away. I'm hoping we get there. My fingers are crossed. [00:40:36] Speaker B: Amen. Yeah, yeah, yeah. [00:40:40] Speaker A: So what do you hope for in the future? Just with what impact are you hoping to make after doing all these speaking engagements and writing these books? [00:40:51] Speaker B: Yeah, so, I mean, I went back to school to hopefully do this work full time. That's the goal of. I don't have a lot of time to write at the moment, but grad school kind of takes over my life, and, you know, as it should. [00:41:08] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:41:08] Speaker B: But after school, I do plan on writing a fourth book that will be very specifically advocacy based. Like, I'm proud of the work that I've done to this point. I'm glad that it's prepared me and taught me, like, how to write my story and, like, structure a book and all those things, like, are valuable tools. But even right now, with the speaking events I'm getting, I can feel this shift of, like, we need you to tell us who you are, Emily, and we need you to be more vulnerable. Like, a lot of the events I've spoken at up until now have been more, like, lecture style, like, teaching about a subject. And so, you know, seeing this shift in the request of people, like, wanting me to tell about me, I see that shift continuing in my writing as well. I just haven't gotten there yet. So, you know, just hope to continue to be the light and ultimately, you know, respond to whatever next step that God is calling me to. [00:42:17] Speaker A: Does it make you a little nervous to kind of have to put yourself out there a little more that way? [00:42:24] Speaker B: It did initially. The more that I heal from my own story personally, which is, you know, a never ending journey. Right? [00:42:33] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah. [00:42:34] Speaker B: The more I heal, the less I'm ashamed, and quite honestly, the less I care what people think. Like, it just, like, if you're not gonna be receptive to this message of just, like, survivors deserve to have a voice and be respected and, like, yeah, then, I don't know what to say. Right. [00:42:56] Speaker A: It's just this message isn't for you. [00:42:59] Speaker B: Right? Yeah. [00:43:00] Speaker A: So. Absolutely. And I guess the topic of shame, I think that's a big one for someone that's been through these kinds of things, whether it's sexual harassment or rape. What was it like to try and process that and kind of get back to, you know, what? No. I am a complete person, as I am, regardless of what happened to me or what's going to happen to me. [00:43:30] Speaker B: Like, overcoming that shame. You know, I think at the very baseline, it's like, the more that I believe that what happened wasn't my fault, the easier, the less I feel ashamed. But also just, like, there's that extra level of shame of, like, what does the world think about how I share my story? I guess I've had plenty of people even ask me, like, what. What are you doing? Doing all this? [00:44:02] Speaker A: Right? [00:44:03] Speaker B: Like, what are you thinking? And I'm just like, you know, like, what are you. I don't know. It honestly is mind blowing, but it's just like, I feel like I have to, you know, like, it just. And that the more that I embody that confidence, also, the less that I'm ashamed. Like, it just. I don't know how else to say that, but there's a lot of doubters out there, and. And the more that you allow those doubters to influence you, the more easy it is to become ashamed. [00:44:40] Speaker A: Right. And also, you're living your truth. You know, you're not. You're not hiding anymore, so to speak. So it's. It gives you. For me, it gives it, like, a sense of just power of, here I am. And, you know, this thing doesn't necessarily define me. It's the fact that I overcame it. That's the part that we're going to focus on. And you have mentioned to me that you are actually doing a speaking engagement on a military installation pretty soon. [00:45:12] Speaker B: Yeah, in a few weeks. That's next on my list to work on, for sure. [00:45:19] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:45:20] Speaker B: So, yeah, I met some people that are advocates in the National Guard a couple months ago and went out to the base recently to meet with their team. And, yeah, super excited for that opportunity. I personally am not in the military, but both of my parents were in the army, so I was kind of raised in that militant culture, I guess. Very by the book. [00:45:50] Speaker A: Yep. Yeah, same here. That's. I grew up, and my mom was the. The service member, and then I ended up joining, and so did my younger brother. But it's different. It's a lot of people, they really don't understand the rigidness of just how that life is. And that, to me, also made it very difficult when my assault happened, because I grew up in that environment and to me, the uniform was family, it was safety, it was community. It was all of these very, very positive things. And then when that became a source of pain and angst and danger, it kind of just broke me, like, mentally, emotionally, spiritually. [00:46:45] Speaker B: It was like having to rediscover what family is and what safety is. [00:46:50] Speaker A: And you spend your whole life knowing that grass is green and the sky is blue, and then boom, one day it's the exact opposite. So it was. Whole world just shifted and it's. It broke, really, the. The trust that I had in myself, too, because for me, it was, how do I find safety again after this? And I think safety is a big thing for people that have been through all the different levels of this kind of trauma is how do I know these people are safe? How do I know this place is safe? How do I know that I'm safe? [00:47:34] Speaker B: And without that sense of safety, it really is hard to take action. A lot of time, which is going back into feeding into why survivors don't speak up to begin with. They don't know who's safe. They don't know where his safety is. They, yeah, like, it's just. Yeah, I think people take for granted, like, the level of pain it takes to reshare, you know, a painful experience, definitely. And that's not something people want to do unless they know that they're going to be taken care of. [00:48:08] Speaker A: And when you shared any of this with your parents, how did they respond and how did they take it? [00:48:19] Speaker B: I didn't share what happened with me with my parents for quite a while. [00:48:24] Speaker A: Same. [00:48:25] Speaker B: And I love my parents. They'll probably listen to this when I post it, so. Hi, mom and hi, dad. [00:48:32] Speaker A: You should be very proud. [00:48:35] Speaker B: Yeah, I don't know. Like, I. Yeah, my friends growing up were always the people that I turned to is like, you know, for advice, more so than my family. Like, I. I was blessed with a really great set of friends from a very young age and kept those friends my whole childhood. So that was always my go to, to begin with. And that's who I turned to, you know, as well, were friends that I had made in college. But, yeah, I don't know. Like, it's like I said, feelings weren't really something that were talked about in my house growing up. Like, I just. I wasn't a big crier as a kid. Like, I. I had to learn how to feel as an adult. And so, like, having that overwhelming feeling, like, it just was so. It's such foreign territory I can understand. [00:49:34] Speaker A: And, I mean, it's. Because it's more than one. There's pain, anger, shame, and, like, the anger is actually rage. So it's all of these very, very, very large feelings, and I think underneath all of them is fear. So that's. That's kind of the basis for all of these things. And if you have trouble expressing it to begin with, coming out and even just telling, like, a therapist or someone in your community, like, that's ridiculous. I am so impressed with your journey and just what an impact that you've made on people's lives with your book and your groups and ministering to people. Amazing. Especially now hearing that it was difficult for you to even register what you were feeling at the time. So that's incredible. High five from over here. [00:50:35] Speaker B: Thank you. [00:50:39] Speaker A: Yeah, I think, like, a lot of people, they don't. They don't get it until either they go through it or someone very close to them has. But the mindset is very similar. They're like, oh, well, you know, when someone breaks their arm, you put a cast on it, and then you wait eight weeks or however long, and you're good. It does not work that way. [00:51:07] Speaker B: No. [00:51:08] Speaker A: Unfortunately, no. So, were there any resources that you could suggest to maybe our listeners, things that might have helped you through your journey? Books, favorite authors, speakers, podcasts? [00:51:26] Speaker B: Yeah. Let's see. So, for me, at the time that I reported what had happened to me, I didn't report to the police, but just shared with people what had happened. Nobody really guided me in the way of that. There were places out there that even, like, helped survivors. I don't know if that just wasn't a thing that was talked about back then. But at least here in Utah, I know there's at least 13 rape crisis centers throughout the state that are, like, there to help people who are, you know, have been raped. And that there are, you know, if you're in trial for a case of sexual assault, like, you are entitled to have someone there with you to support you, like, an advocate, like, and just, you know, being confident enough to claim that and, you know, ask for what you deserve. I think that's really hard when you're in a spot that you feel so worthless and vulnerable. But, like, yeah, wherever you're located and listening to this, like, there are places out there and people that want to help you. Like, there's a 24 hours sexual assault hotline. I can't tell you the number off the top of my head, but, like, call it. Reach out to somebody, like, don't do this alone. Yeah. [00:52:57] Speaker A: That is absolutely terrific advice. I tried to do it alone for a while and that was just by keeping it inside. And I went the alcohol route like so many of us do. [00:53:12] Speaker B: Amen. Yep, that was me. [00:53:14] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:53:15] Speaker B: And it might numb the pain for a night, but it doesn't take away the trauma, so. [00:53:20] Speaker A: Absolutely. Yeah. And I was lucky enough not to get into anything, like, heavier that would truly, like, harmed me. But so many people do. So definitely find someone to lean on and share that with. And there's so many people out there that want to be there with you to support, support you. So we're two of them, but there's so many more out there. And definitely it's, again, we've said it before, but it's not your fault that someone made this choice to do something so horrible and it does not determine your worth or devalue you in any way, shape or form, so. Right, yeah, definitely underline that because wrestling with the guilt and everything is so difficult. But when you get through it, I would say once someone had asked me, one of my therapists had asked me what it felt like to me, and I was like walking through wet cement and flip flops, basically. But when you get to the other side, it's totally worth it. Like, you become, I don't know, like Paul Bunyan or just someone huge and powerful in your mind. And that's where the healing starts and it's finding a sense of power. So do whatever you can to find that. And, yeah, any last tidbits you want to share with our guest, Emily? [00:54:58] Speaker B: Yeah, feel free to reach out. You know, I'm sure you're going to share this on yours, social media and whatnot. You can find me at Emily Bernathauthor on Instagram or emilyburnath author.com. but yeah, happy to talk if people need someone to talk to. [00:55:17] Speaker A: Wonderful. And yep, we'll have all of her books in the show notes as well as her website. And you also have a, there was a link on your website to, like, book you for speaking engagements. Pretty sure it was at the top. So put that in there as well. I want to give just a huge thank you to you for coming on here and sharing your journey with us and being able to provide just another unique perspective on this issue. And I know it's not easy to come on here and, you know, divulge it all over again. But thank you so much for that. [00:55:54] Speaker B: Yeah, thanks for having me. [00:55:56] Speaker A: Absolutely. Remember, our voices are weapons in the fight against MST. Stay connected, share your story, and join our fight to end military sexual trauma for good. Until next time, thanks for listening to the silenced voices of MsThenne.